Why Patient-Centered Wins: Data Integrity, Access, and Trust with Jessicah Fowler-dental-patient-experience-satisfaction

In this episode of Kinda Different, Dr. Matt Allen interviews Jessica Fowler, a dynamic figure in the dental industry who bridges the gap between clinical practice and technology. They discuss the importance of patient-centered care, the role of innovation in dentistry, and the significance of mindfulness in professional life. Jessica shares her journey from being a dental hygienist to working in dental SaaS, emphasizing the need for data integrity and the human aspect of healthcare. The conversation also touches on lessons learned from firefighter culture and the importance of authenticity in personal and professional interactions.

‍

Listen in on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, watch on Youtube below, or check out the trasncript.

‍

Transcript:

What's up, everyone? Welcome back to Kinda Different, a podcast where we talk about dental innovation. We meet some of the best people in this amazing industry, and we talk about how we all together can make dental care and health care more human.
I am Dr. Matt Allen, CEO and co-founder of DifferentKind, and your host for Kinda Different. And today, I'm absolutely thrilled to have somebody who certainly understands what it's like to be on the clinical side of dental care, but also understands what it's like to be on the technological side of dental care. Somebody who really, I think, has a pretty good lay of the land in terms of how what we do as people who are developing technology in the space impacts what that feels like in clinical care, which is always super important.
So Jessica Fowler, a good friend, somebody who I'm thrilled to know. Thank you so much for taking the time to join us. Jessica has been around SAS, but she's also been on the clinical side.
Like I said, really just has a really good lay of the land. I also feel like, Jessica, I don't know if this, I don't want to put you in a box, but I watch a lot of soccer, soccer is like my thing. You always are looking for guys coming up of like, who's gonna be the next superstar, right?
And I feel like you're just kinda like the next dental superstar that a lot of people in like three years are gonna be like, oh yeah, I remember when, before she was like the VP of whatever, this big company. So I feel like that's you, I feel like that's the track you're on, really influential and somebody who, again, I'm just really excited to know. So thanks for taking the time to join us today.
Why don't you start off, just tell us a little bit about yourself and then we'll dive into some questions.
Yeah, no, that's awesome. And you're no pun intended to kind with your intro there. No, I appreciate all those kind words.
And I, yeah, I'm Jessica. You know, I am. It's hard.
It's hard to like introduce myself because I've been like so many places. But really, I'm just a human. I mean, I'm just going to say that, honestly, like just a human.
I started out as a general hygienist. I actually started in Perio. So like kind of the hardest at first, and then went backward.
But just got a really strong foundation for, for just skills, like as a hygienist. And it carried over into other practices, like GP practices. I wore like all the hats in, in private practice, mainly the IT hat.
I've always had like this kind of a computer nerd. But always helped with, you know, workflows and implementing new software into the practice. And I decided to take a leap of faith and really use LinkedIn.
But, you know, jumped into the world of dental SAS and, you know, took a, took a short stint in SAS sales and then worked at Uptime Health, helping build their partnerships department. And now I am at Superior Education. So, yeah, I just kind of go all over the place, but I'm passionate about everything that I do.
And so, you know, that's why I'm just going to introduce myself as a human.
Perfect. I love it.
I love it.
That's certainly that we will we will talk about how we can together, right? I make this industry embrace that humanity. So, you know, let's let's start with kind of the innovation side of things.
So you've, again, kind of been on both sides of the aisle, which I think is so important, so valuable, right? And I feel that way, too, right? Like I think back all the time to what it feels like as a clinician, to do something, you know, all of those things.
You talk about this, you kind of like sense of, hey, when I was a clinician, I, you know, I found an interest in the technology and, you know, those kinds of pieces, but you also describe yourself as a human, which I think is really important, right? So why is, in dentistry currently, why, what's your perspective on, like, why being person-centered or patient-centered, you know, is innovative? Like, what feels cutting edge about that, in the same way that AI feels cutting edge for so many of us?
What feels innovative about being able to look a person in the eye and have a meaningful and real conversation with them in dental care?
Yeah, no, that's, that's a great question. I feel like, honestly, I mean, it's, it's accomplished through people. No, yes, you have AI, you have, you know, all of the things, right?
Technology, different software, Excel. I mean, we all hate Excel. You have all of that.
But at the end of the day, like when innovation actually happens, I mean, it's carried out by people, you know, by humans. And so with, I have an interesting take on like innovation in dentistry and with it being patient-centered because you're talking about an industry that, I mean, and I'll, I mean, I'd say it if I wasn't a prior clinician still probably, but I mean, it's archaic. It's an archaic industry.
I mean, so slow to move, slow to adopt. And essentially, if you think about it, like it's, it's literally, it's a world that's created on fear. Like everyone fears the dentist.
No one, well, some people like the dentist.
Most people fear the dentist.
Most people fear it. So it's, it's driven off of fear. And I think that that's kind of why maybe dentistry has just been so slow to advance because that's such a negative, negative thing, right?
And so I feel like almost, you know, having, which is really cool, just all the synergy, having, you know, these people from the business, you know, industry, like the corporate sector and technology and finance, like all of these people kind of coming into the space, it almost, having their perspective, right, is starting to advance that innovation. I mean, I feel like you can only do so much within a dental practice, right? Like when you are patient-facing, you can try your hardest, you know, but when you have all these cool new tools, and I mean, that's what AI is, is a tool, is you have all of this coming into the space.
I think that it really does, it impacts not only the industry, but also the patient as well. I think that it will end up kind of lowering that threshold when it comes to just fear, like fearful of coming to the dentist, because essentially we are just equipping patients with more power, really. You know, like, I don't, am I allowed to say names like Overja, Pearl, like those people?
You can say whatever names you want.
All right, all right.
You can add Ward on here. Yeah, there's no CE being given out, so you can do whatever you want.
Okay. You know, like, you have all these things that are visuals and patients see them. And like, you know, as a dentist, we try to equip the patient with knowledge so they're more comfortable and informed.
Like, being informed makes an environment, you know, less stressful. And so, yeah, I'm starting to ramble now, but long story short, that's kind of my take on your question, just with patient-centered, you know, focus on innovation. I think that it just all ties together and it's coming together nicely just with how the way things are moving.
Totally. Yeah, I think, you know, maybe a few thoughts kind of based on what you're saying there. We had Matt McGahn recently.
I mean, he was talking just a little bit about, you know, like, ultimately, like, organizational change still has to happen, right? And you can have the best tool, you know, you know, whatever. So to your point, to your original point, right?
Like, the people who carry this out are people, right? And I think that ultimately, you know, that piece is super important. And I think another thing that, you know, I certainly feel this, right, as or see this, I guess, in the industry is that, you know, your point around, you know, for a long time, it was solo private practice was kind of the only way to go, right?
And it's really hard to be the clinician and be all the other things, right? Something has to give. You can't like do everything.
And so as the industry has brought in more folks to like actually run the businesses and run HR and do all the things that like need to be done in the same way that a hospital has those things and a big medical group has those things, right? Is that you end up like having the time, space, energy and the personnel to like actually be able to accomplish those things. So I don't know.
I feel like that piece really lends itself well to, all right, we know that those tools are coming that are going to advance the technology. Hopefully what that allows you to do is like sit down and be a better human, right? In your interaction with the patient.
Because if you don't, I think you're going to get left behind. I mean, that's certainly my perspective there, right? Of you got to get good at the technology, but it's not just getting good at the technology.
It's going to make the human side even more important.
Right, right. No, you're exactly right. I mean, it literally, it opens more space for you to carry out those human interactions.
Like, it's so important. That's a really good point.
Cool. Well, I certainly appreciate your perspective there. One of the things that I always like to kind of understand, too, just in terms of where innovation is and different people are doing different things.
So what's the thing that you're most excited about right now when it comes to dental innovation? What really is floating your boat in terms of, hey, this is something that really gets me excited in the morning?
The biggest thing that's exciting for me in dental innovation is just going to be the clinical side kind of opening up and being more accepting of practices around, data workflows, like that piece, because that's something that, I mean, I'm a huge, I'm becoming a very like massive advocate for is just like the fact that we have all of this technology, all these software, we say the word data, we talk about data, input data, but it's important and it's kind of interesting. I've seen now being at a few different SAS companies and also having that clinical lens and knowing how the vast majority of dental teams and clinicians operate. Not very many of them are aware when it comes to how important data is and or that technology side.
And so I like it because everything that we deal with, especially in the dental office, it's all data. You know, address, name, period numbers, like whatever, whatever. It's all data.
And so I think that one thing that's going to be really important and critical, though, is to really embrace the innovation is going to be to also raise awareness on some issues within practices. I'm sure it happens just in DSOs as well. Like, the quality of data going in to these systems is so, so important.
I've just seen it, like, it stalls out at a certain point. Like, when you talk about business success or end user seeing the value, you know, seeing the ROI in your investment. And I feel like people right now are at this point where, yes, like, innovation is going crazy, but, like, we're at a standstill.
So you have businesses that are, like, wondering, you know, why churn so high or scratching their heads? Like, what's the disconnect? Then you have practices, doctors that are frustrated because they just, you know, paid for the software and they're not, I mean, we all, you and I know, like, most dentists are not very tech savvy offices, all of that, right?
And so, like, everyone's hesitant to, you know, adopt a new software anyways, but it's like, once you're in it, you're in it, and then you're just like, I don't even know why I, like, signed up for this, right? And it's all, it all stems just from the end user, the practices and the doctors and the hygienists in front of us, not understanding the importance of, you know, data integrity. And so, that's something I think that that's going to be very important to raise awareness on in order for innovation, like, where we're at to, like, truly thrive, you know?
Totally. Yeah, if you can't trust what's in the system, right, you can't act on it, you can't do the right things on it. And we can talk all you want about data interoperability and get it, you know, all of the many ways that, like, data can use innovation within dental care right now.
But if you don't have the right stuff in there, you know, it's the same as, you know, with AI in general, right? If you can get a really crappy answer, if you give it a bad prompt or a very generic prompt, and if you give it a really good prompt, right? Like, you can get pretty specific and you can really refine it.
So it's the same, right? Like, we've got to be able to put good inputs in to be able to get the outputs that we want.
Yep, exactly, exactly.
So, yeah, love that perspective. Certainly really foundational and I think probably underlooked sometimes when, you know, or overlooked, sorry, not underlooked, underappreciated, overlooked when it comes to, like, how do we actually drive things forward here? Right, yeah.
All right, well, let's learn a little bit more about you. So I, you know, kind of said, hey, this is Jessica when we're coming in, and here she's going to be the next big thing in dentistry, right? And everyone's going to know your name and know your face and whatever.
So let's learn more about you. One of the things that I always like to know from people, I love development and I love learning, and I love kind of the quest to always understand more about ourselves and get better, you know, both in our jobs, but just in life. So when you think about, you know, something that you're learning right now, and, like, how does that kind of form into, like, a goal that you might have for the rest of the year?
We're coming into fall, you know, it feels like a changing of season almost, you know, it's just like, okay, cool, what's the four months left? What's the what's the goal for, you know, that kind of here's what I'm learning. And here's, like, what I want that to do for me over the course of the rest of the year.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
You have to be at work at all if you don't want it. If you if you want to get down the personal side of things, hey, we're happy to hear about that.
OK, OK. So it doesn't matter.
I can go professional or whatever you want to do.
100% OK, because this one, this is universal. You can use it professionally.
It's mindfulness, mindfulness, like I it's powerful. It is so powerful. I'm not like, I didn't just start learning.
And I mean, it's different because you can like, read an article or like, you know, see an article on Medium pop across and it's like talking about mindfulness and you read it and you're like, yes, no, that resonates. Learning is cool. I'm gonna take a twist on your question though and say, I'm gonna put a twist on it and say like, practicing, like what am I practicing, right?
Because I've been practicing mindfulness and it's like so beneficial, obviously in your personal life, but professionally too. I, it honestly just comes down to like just stopping, which I feel like we all have such a problem, problem doing really like everybody does, but literally just stopping and like naming what you, what you're feeling, like whatever emotion it is that you're feeling. And that a lot of the times, I mean, we'll go the professional route, but like it's so beneficial just first for that like work-life balance, right?
Like, because if you're not, you're not really like super stressed at work all the time, obviously that's good for you at home, vice versa, but like it opens up opportunity, really. When you slow down, name the emotion, just sit with it for a second, like it gives you a different lens to whatever it is that you're looking at. I mean, you could be super excited about something, but for me personally, I mean, like you come across something at work that you're like, what?
Like, what is this? Like, what do I, oh God, what do I need to do here? But like just literally stopping and sitting with it for a second, it makes a click in your head and you're like, oh, and then you start thinking about things outside of what you normally would when you're in that moment and you're letting whatever it is get the best of you.
But yeah, so I mean, like I'm really, I'm a huge advocate first off just for mental health in general. But as far as like what I'm really honestly like putting a lot of my focus on is just practicing mindfulness because I learned a lot about it and you can learn something, you know, all day, all week, all month.
Knowledge is not, you know, lived experience, right?
Right, exactly. If you don't put it into action consistently, right, then, you know, I mean, it might work a little bit, but you're not gonna, you're not gonna get those full benefits.
Reap the benefits. So do you have any goals specifically around it? You know, like, is there any, like, hey, this is, you know, if you don't, but if you do share them, I would love to hear.
No, I mean, honestly, I think my end goal is just to this is probably not even great for the podcast. I'm sorry, Matt.
Hey, that's all right. It's authentic, right? Go for it.
Yes.
Yes. You know what? That's my goal is to stay authentic.
You know what? I love, yes, that's actually my goal. I'm stealing it.
Well, my goal is to stay authentic because as I've been practicing mindfulness and whatnot, it makes things more quiet. It kinda like quiets the noise a little bit. You come to see that there, I mean, there are really great people out there.
I mean, most humans are great. But you see the authentic ones a lot better when things are quiet. And those are the gems.
Like, you know, and that's, I mean, that could be applied personally, I guess. But now I have my professional lens on because I feel like even looping it back to the whole innovation piece, like, you know, you and DifferentKind, like, I just don't understand why you guys aren't literally everywhere.
Like, because, you know, we will be up-and-comers, right? You gotta be, you gotta have up-and-comers, right?
No, but that's the thing is that, like, you're, you are authentic. Like, I could tell it from the get, but, like, the people like you and all the other ones out there, like, y'all are the ones that are gonna really make change. And I think that's what it, that's what it's about at the end of the day is just creating like massive change, especially in this industry, because there's so much room for improvement.
So, yeah, I mean, just my goal is to stay authentic because I see, you know, authentic people and just it's worth it. It's worth it for sure.
That's a good one. Being authentic is worth it for sure. I 100% agree with that.
Yeah.
Well, let's like take some of that connection piece in terms of being mindful and being human and the innovation piece that we've already talked about and kind of wrap it together, right, in this idea of making dental care more human. So one thing that I love to kind of think about is just our experience outside of dental care, because when you are inside of it, it's hard to, you know, to associate yourself from it. And so what's one kind of formative experience in your mind outside of health care that you're like, wow, that was really good, or that really shaped me in a way that made me feel, you know, that this is something that's really important or whatever.
So just kind of like give us that, like, hey, this was a, this is something that I love that was outside of dentistry that, you know, was maybe somewhere else in health care that really said, hey, this is, this is what we can do in dentistry.
Yeah, yeah. Okay, yeah, no, I can do that. So let's see.
Oh gosh. Yeah, I would say that one experience that probably stands out the most for me at least is, and I guess it's not too much outside of dentistry, but, you know, just the normal, you know, medical office. You, I don't know how to word this.
So not to get too in the weeds, but, oh, and I have to say this on the podcast.
Hey, look at that.
I know. I thought it might be on the screen. That's why I was.
I know it's not. I don't have. Oh, here we go.
Hold on. Look at this. Look what I got.
So I'm going off camera for this. You got Be Kind.
I've got. Love it.
Here we go.
Boom. Oh, my gosh. I need that on my card.
Yeah, there you go. You can. I'll get you some of those.
So give your shirt. Put your shirt on.
Yes, it does.
Put your shirt so we could see it. That is a much more appropriate way of saying what I'm trying to say.
Yeah.
Yeah.
There it is. There it is. Be kind.
Be authentic. Be kind. You know.
There you go.
Yes. No, I love it.
I love it.
So as far. Actually, no, let me think of. Let me get out of health care because that's initially.
Yeah, that's great. I love it.
Okay. So, oh, you know what? I'm going to take it back home to my husband.
Okay. He's a firefighter. He's a fire captain.
They as far as as training goes, I thought actually it's okay. Now it's clicking. All right.
So one thing that I've thought of multiple occasions is the camaraderie that because it's, I mean, they call each other brothers and sisters, but that's always been like such a tight knit community. But it's not just like when they're in the firehouse or eating or whatever, but it goes into even their training. My husband, he put together a program for like new rookies coming into the department.
And the way that they operate is just so, I don't even want to call it team oriented, but like I've thought multiple occasions like, God, why do we not, like, why do, you know, not just even in the dental practice. I mean, yes, it can apply there, but just even just within, you know, a company. Why are we not that close-knit?
Because they mean, you know, you know their job. I mean, they're running into buildings that are burning down, like, saving people in them, whatever it might be. Like, their, their position is high stress, like, higher than you and I will experience.
Even back in the day when we were in the dental office, when you, like, feel like it's, you know, you're in a building burning down, but they're able to keep that tight-knit, like, just that camaraderie. I'm gonna say, like, love for each other in, like, any instance. So when, when he was putting together this training program, so when he was putting together this training program, it was, like, the first lesson, almost, to these new rookies was around, like, the brotherhood.
And that's what they call it, the brotherhood. I know that there are female firefighters, but just brotherhood. And starting with that, it makes everything else, from what I can see and, like, what I've heard from him, flow a lot easier.
And again, just such high stress situations. But when they start with, like, we're a team, like, we're a brotherhood, like, we're together, it's not, like, they're not separate. It's so strong, like, and everything else after it.
I mean, yeah, you have hiccups and bumps in the road, but, like, the environment is just, it's crazy. It's crazy.
I love that.
So, yeah, that's a unique, sorry, I kinda went, like, rogue on that one, but...
I like it. No, I think that there's a lot that we could learn, you know, from the idea of what kind of culture that is and what that feels like, right? You know, for those, you know, firefighters and how that then translates into how they interact with people, right?
On the street and, you know, in these places, wherever they're going to do their job, right? I think it really matters, right? And so it's hard to love your neighbor, right?
You know, if you're, you know, not having that kind of strong foundation where you're like, unknown, I'm seen, I'm loved, you know, by my work colleagues, right? And the appropriate work kind of way. So, yeah, no, I think that's a really interesting insight.
And I think that there's probably, you know, I don't know, but I would guess that, like, someone has done some research on, you know, that kind of like idea of like, what is, what does that look like in fire culture, right? My brother-in-law is a fire chief in Denver. Actually, when I was driving into work today, they were doing the fill the boot, you know, out in.
Yeah, yeah.
So, yeah, all that to say, I bet there's some pretty interesting insight into like, how that actually impacts their life and how they're doing things.
Yeah, that's awesome. Yeah. But yeah, sorry.
Yeah.
You're good. All good. Cool.
Well, you know, one of the things that I, you know, we, I always say, like, we, I feel like we could talk about these things for a long time because we care about them, we think about them all the time. And we also want to create a, you know, experience where people can listen to a podcast on their way to work or whatever it might be. So if people want to get in touch with you and kind of chat more, understand more about Jessica, learn more about, you know, what you care about, whatever it might be, how they get in touch with you, where should they go?
Give us, give us some details.
Um, I would say your best bet would just be reaching out on LinkedIn. Jessica with an H at the end. Okay.
Not, it's still pronounced Jessica, but throwing that out there. And then last name Fowler, F-O-W-L-E-R. But yeah, no, just reach out to me on LinkedIn.
I'm sure if you're, you know, watching this, we've probably connected, but just shoot me a message. Um, yeah, I love to connect with anyone and everyone. So just hold her at me.
Awesome. Well, thank you so much for taking the time to come on. Thanks for the conversation.
We really appreciate it. And, uh, yeah, we're, I know that as, as you continue to become more ubiquitous within the dental industry, right, people will look back and they'll be like, oh yeah, like I know her husband's a firefighter now. And, oh yeah, like I know she cares about mindfulness and she probably had practice help today, right?
Like people will know more about you. And hopefully that will, you know, benefit everyone, right? That's all one of our goals here is to create those connections even outside of, you know, an actual human human.
Yeah. No, I love it. I hope please somebody one day be like, are you still authentic?
I'll be like, hey, yeah, there you go.
Love it. Sweet. Well, thanks so much for taking the time, Jessica.
We really appreciate it. And we'll look forward to talking to you soon.
Thank you so much, Matt. Thank you.