⏰ The alarm bell is ringing because a new episode of Kinda Different is here! We are thrilled to be joined by Dr. Mary Pham, CEO and founder of Lollipop Pediatric Dentistry and Orthodontics. Mary and Matt chat about empathetic leadership that asks the question, "What Do Our Patients Need?", how the Lollipop name was born, and the importance of helping your team discover the passion for your mission.
You can find Mary and Lollipop at the following places:
Website: https://www.lollipopdental.com
Email: drmary@lollipopdental.com
Watch the whole episode below, or listen on Spotify/Apple Podcasts:
Lightly Edited Transcript:
Matt Allen
What's up everyone? Welcome back to another episode of Kinda Different, a podcast where we talk about innovation in dental care. We connect with some absolutely amazing people in this industry and we talk together about how we can all make dental care more human. I am Dr. Matt Allen, the host of Kinda Different, CEO of Different Kind, and super excited to be joined today by Dr. Mary Pham, who I'm sure many of you know from her amazing work, excited to hear more of her perspective of building what she's built and her plans for it and how she intends to really make an excellent patient experience in all that she does. So we're just really excited to have her on today. Mary, thank you so much for taking the time and would love to have you just give a little deeper introduction of yourself to all of our listeners.
Mary Pham:
So thank you so much, Matt, for the introduction. So my name is Dr. Mary Pham, and I'm the CEO and founder of Lollipop Pediatric Dentistry and Orthodontics, located in Orange County in LA, California. We have seven locations, and we're just having a great time continuing to grow and scale our organization with the excellence in specialty dental care that we strive so hard to achieve. So yeah, that's a little bit about it.
Matt Allen
Lovely. And I love the story about how you came up with the name. And we'll maybe we'll talk about that in just a couple minutes. But let's start off thinking about because like, obviously, you're building a growing organization with all the pop and you know, things are really kind of, you know, like I said, it just seems like I see you everywhere, which is awesome. So obviously, you're doing something right. One of the things that I love to always ask people is this idea of like, wave your magic wand and transform one thing about dental care, right?
Because essentially that's kind of what you get to do in your organization, right? Is like, maybe it's not a magic wand, but you get to say, hey, here's the vision that we're casting. So if you could just wake up tomorrow and magically transform one thing about dental care in general, what would it be in one?
Mary Pham
I would say to make sure that the like if I had a magic wand and I could change one thing. Honestly, it's kind of like what we're doing right now at scale, which our vision is just to make sure that every single child no matter what their reimbursement rates or payer types gets quality specialty dental care and an amazing dental experience. I wish that I could provide that for every single child that walked out. Like that's not just walks in our doors, but in the world, like for all of mankind, because I hear of so many experiences that are very unfortunate for children, not only from children nowadays, but from their parents. So they always say, I wish that I had this experience growing up because in my country or the other dentists I went to recently, didn't have the same type of standards and quality of care and patient experience that we have here. So I think that that's something that makes Lollipop really special is that we're able to create a profitable business that is doing what we dreamed of without having to compromise on anything. So that's something that we're really proud of. And
Again, like I mentioned, if I could wave a magic wand, I wouldn't change anything about my company. I wouldn't change anything about my team, but I just wish that I could serve more children the way that we do with the same level of the quality of care and the experience that we provide to more children.
Matt Allen
I love that. I love that. I mean, I think it really speaks to, you know, operationalizing the vision, right? Of like, Hey, here's, here's what our vision is and we're doing that. Right. It's it's happening every single day. And obviously like, yeah, like the vision is something that you're probably never will attain. Otherwise it's probably not a big enough vision. Right. So, um, I absolutely love that. Can you just give us an insight into what you just talked about though, in terms of, Hey, we want to provide this kind of quality, uh, with amazing patient experience, uh, for these, for these kids. And, you know, honestly for their parents, right? I mean, just pediatric dentistry sometimes is just as much about making the parents feel comfortable as it is making the kids feel comfortable. You know, can you just kind of give us some specific insight into kind of the secret sauce for lollipop in terms of how you do that? Like what specifically are things that you're like, hey, you know, it's this or that really helps us to, you know, be lollipop essentially.
Mary Pham
I think that one thing that me as the CEO and founder really take pride in is just making sure that we're continuing to innovate, that we're continuing to stay on top of technology. If you look at where we were 10 years ago to where we are now, we've adopted so many different things that allow us to continue to provide that quality of care, but just better and faster.
You know, and I think if you look at the world today, people want convenience. They want like everything given to them really quickly, like Amazon Prime, right? Or, you know, like if you actually have to go pick up your coffee instead of having Uber Eats delivers it to you. I think there's a value in that. And so I try to put myself into the the eyes of my patients and their families and say, how can I make it more convenient to them to come to Lollipop? So part of it is we open Saturdays, we have late hours. We try to fulfill their needs not just in dentistry, but in their whole family life. Like how can I make it more convenient for you to come? How can I make it quicker? How do I provide the same level of patient experience?
But we text a lot more now. We stopped calling patients as much. So I think those things that actually automate a lot of our business operations too, allows us to not only communicate with our patients the way that they like, but also just making sure that we're available and accessible anytime that they need us. And so we have 24 hour chat, we have messaging, we have AI in our offices. So there's just a lot of things that I think we implement that really just continue the excellence that we stand for. But again, scaling that as we grow in order to be just more efficient.
Matt Allen
Yeah, totally. I love that. I think there's a real deep customer empathy, right? Patient empathy there to say, you know, I think a lot of clinicians might approach their schedule from the perspective of what do I want, right? Not what do my patients need or what do my patients want? So I don't want to be open on Saturdays or I don't want to be open late, late hours. But oftentimes that's, you know, those are the appointments that are in most demand, you know, for a lot of patients. And so I do think that there's just a deep customer empathy and patient empathy from just that simple perspective of, Hey, like. When do we need to be open? That really speaks to, it sounds like what is happening all throughout your organization, which is absolutely amazing. So I love that insight. Thank you so much for sharing. And obviously I think staying in front of the curve on technology is something that, yes, like you said, if we can provide exceptional convenience for patients, certainly that is important in this digital age. So thank you so much for sharing that.
I would love to have our listeners learn a little bit more about you when we got a chance to meet a couple weeks ago for the first time, which was awesome. Actually, we met one time in March, but that was brief. When we got a chance to chat, actually, though, a few weeks ago, I loved the story about the idea of how you kind of came up with the name Lollipop and just a little bit of that backstory. Can you just share that? Because I think it's such a fun story that I never would have guessed, I guess. So, yeah.
Mary Pham
Yeah, of course. So when I was a resident at the University of Illinois in Chicago, I again, I think this is what we were talking about of just listening to what your customer and your patients wanted. So I used to, you know, of course, every dental office gives everyone a baggie with a toothpaste, a toothbrush, floss, and that's like the standard packet, right? Or baggie. So I would give it to the children and they would open it thinking it was some sort of treat, like a Halloween treat bag, and they would never be super excited about what they got. And even to this day, we give away toothbrushes and toothpaste during Halloween, but we put snacks in there too, as I like to call lollipop, of course. So then I decided at that time to look for different options that would give them a reason to smile. when they came to the dentist, because it is tough getting dental treatment done, especially at such a young age. So I found these xylitol lollipops and I started just putting them in the baggie. And then what I became known as at school was the lollipop dentist. And so I told myself if I were to, like I could see their eyes light up just from that 25 cent lollipop. And I realized that was why I did what I did. I mean, the dentistry is something that is really special, right? Because you're able to heal the patient. But I think seeing their smile at the end from this one little thing really was like the cherry on top of what you just did, you know? So that's how the name came about. So then when we opened the practice, I had to name it Lollipop Dental. And, you know, I would say 99.9% of patients love the name. That 1% will say like, isn't it kind of counterintuitive with lollipops and the dentist. And so, but then we had to actually wrap that into our tour when we're giving information to the patient that, hey, you know, there are certain options out there if you have a sweet tooth that you can give to the child that's actually good for your teeth and inhibits the bacteria that causes cavities. So here they are. And then there's other options out there now. And so we love educating the public and in a fun way, I think. And that's what pediatric dentists do, right? We try to make every single experience a positive one for the patient, so.
Matt Allen
I love it. I love it. Yeah, it's a great platform, right, to tell that story of like, Hey, you might have never heard of Xylitol. Let me tell you about what it is. I just also love the disappointment of the kids looking in the bag. My son just turned, my youngest son just turned four and he was opening presents with another family and we were telling him specifically this idea of, or we're telling the parents, like, hey, he's pretty, he'll let you know if he doesn't like what he got you. So just be prepared. I don't know what you got him, but just be prepared. And he opened it up and he's like, Oh, I didn't really ask for this. And it was just like so funny to see that exact moment that you're talking about. I'm just like, oh, like kind of disappointment. And he got over it later and actually really liked it. But it was just such a perfect encapsulation of what you're saying that I just saw recently. So absolutely loved that you took that moment and used it to say, hey, how do I actually change that experience for the patient, which is awesome. One of my favorite things that you're obviously an exceptional leader just based on our interactions together, how you're known in the industry, like, you know, what you're building at Lollipop, all of those things. I always love learning from exceptional leaders who they look to for leadership kind of advice, guidance, inspiration, you know, any of those things. So I'd love to hear from you, somebody who is inspiring you right now in your own life.
Mary Pham
I would say it depends on what part of my life right like if you talk about professionally of course everyone in the industry that is movers and shakers and challenging you know like technology and the dentistry the dental industry in general but I would say the people who really inspire me the most are the people that I interact with on a daily basis and it's honestly that are moms that help me with my children that allow me to do what I love without the guilt. You know, like, Hey, Mary, I know that you're doing things for your team. I know you're doing things for your company. This is a priority to you. So let us help you here. So you know, there there's like a real guilt, I think, when it comes to parenting, right, because you're working so much. But I think that everyone's, like level of interaction with whether it's their team or their family. I think it fills their cup in different ways. And so what I've realized is one, I can't really compare myself or my life and what I'm doing with my company or even as a parent get to me, but I have to find gratitude in the things that I'm doing every day. And then find inspiration in the people around me, because I think that's ultimately what drives you. I'm inspired by my husband and the support he gives me, my children who make me want to be a better mom. But I've never been asked this question, and it's hard for me to just choose one person. My parents who molded me into the person that I am. But I would say if I were to choose professionally, it would just be with whoever I surround myself with. Even with you, I'm learning new things every single day.
And then on a day to day, it's the team and the people who really helped me with my children during those times when I do have to jump into a meeting late for whatever reason, you know, so.
Matt Allen
Totally. I love it. There's so much presence in your answer there, which I think is such a, you know, in our age of convenience, which is again important and we all want convenience and all of those things. But I think sometimes that leads to a lack of presence, right, of what's right in front of me might be a really valuable thing. And so there's a lot of like wishing or hoping, or, you know, just kind of moving beyond what's in the present. And I think that can, it really can rob our joy, right? And so in so many ways, just being able to be present is such a unique gift, I would say, in our modern age. And I hear a lot of that kind of word presence in your answer there, which is really beautiful. So thank you for sharing. Yeah. Well, let's talk a little bit about making dental care more human. Obviously something that you care about deeply as a pediatric dentist and really creating these great experiences for a child that will be really the foundation for the rest of their life so that they're not avoiding the dentist in the future because they're like, hey, I was scared of the dentist forever, right? So, you know, one of the things that I always love to hear from people that have really thought about this a lot is that kind of first step, because I think that there's a lot of people who are like, yeah, that sounds great, but what do I do? What's, what's something easy that I can do tomorrow? And so when you think about that, I'd like, how do I make this care as human as possible for our patients as connected and rooted as possible? Here's an easily implementable or maybe it doesn't have to be super easily, but just like, Hey, here's the first step that I would take in terms of, you know, making that a reality in a day to day practice, like at Lollipop, like what would you say there?
Mary Pham
So I think the most important part of creating that human experience for a patient is, believe it or not, not focusing on the clinical portion, which is what most dentists are programmed to do, diagnose x-rays, and then present the treatment options to the patient. But I think what I've learned is that human connection and the trust goes much further than just diagnosing and treating the patient. And so what I tend to do is just listen, read body language, and then, you know, not go over how many times are they brushing, how many times are they flossing, how many cavities do they have? Because I feel like being a dentist,the patients are putting themselves in a very vulnerable position. Like nobody lets anyone look into their mouth or most people smile with their mouth, you know, a little closed because they're embarrassed or they are not happy that they've neglected their smile or their children's smiles for so long. So my goal is for them to know that I'm genuine, that I'm authentic. I really just want to help. And you know, I want them to understand that. Because sometimes I have parents that'll say, I don't trust dentists. I think dentists are all just trying to make money off of us. And the first thing I always say to that is I want you to know that that's absolutely not who we are. I would only recommend what I think is important. But first, tell me a little bit about you guys and your family. Tell me what's important to you as a provider. There's so many great dentists out there.
So I just want to make sure that you're comfortable with me and that if I can help you, I'd love the opportunity to do that. So I take more of that approach. So, especially with children, people, and maybe as adults, because I've only seen children for so long, they'll say, well, I'm going to go get a second opinion. And I'll say, of course I want you to, because there's so many great pediatric dentists, but let me educate you on how to find a good doctor, make sure they're board certified, make sure they're a pediatric dentist, but any of us are great. It's just like who's the perfect match for you and your family. But any questions, definitely reach out to me, more than happy to help there. But at the end of the day, what's most important to me is that your child gets great dental care and a great dental experience. So I think, you know, my job is not to be everyone's dentist. You know, my job is to educate them, make sure that whoever they choose that they're educated enough to choose the right provider for their family and understanding what their needs are. And if I'm the one to fulfill it, great. But if not, that's okay too, you know? So I think just learning to really listen and understanding what their needs are and looking at the dentistry as the last thing, because ultimately like I mentioned, there's so many great dentists, way better than me, that could see this child, but ultimately, that's what's most important, is that they get the dental care, whether it's with me or anyone else. But like, at least they know that my heart is in the right place, and that I'm here to help them. And I would say most of the time, they always come back and say, oh, Dr. Floral, I love you, like we wanna come see you again, you know? But that's the great part of it, I think. That's the, the funnest part of dentistry is I love doing the dentistry, but I love even more. No, like, you know how they say it's all about how you make the patient feel, but it's actually how they make me feel, you know? Like, I love treating your family because you're so sweet, you're so grateful, you're so nice, we jive really well. That's, I think, the best is that human connection between provider and patient.
Matt Allen
There you go, yeah, it provides that kind of fuel to kind of keep going when you're just like, man, this is so relationally filling, right? I think you kind of mentioned filling your cup earlier and certainly, yes, hear that. And even just in your answer there though too, about talking about, I think for a lot of dentists, they might answer that, what is a dentist's job? And they're like, read x-rays, present a treatment plan, but you said present treatment options, right? There are those small things that I think are just who you are as a person probably and how you run your practice, right? Of, hey, like we want to not tell you what to do, but we want to show you what we see and then give you the options of like what's out there, right? And understand your values and what's important to you. And those kinds of things I think are just so critical in terms of building trust. And I love hearing Dennis who are actually doing that on a day-to-day basis. It's just so inspiring to me. So thank you for sharing that answer. I have one more question for you. And I think this is, you know, given your focus on this amazing experience, you know, kind of creating that and I think we just kind of maybe touched on an answer to this. So I'd love to hear something else, right? Like, you know, you just talked a lot about listening, which I think is so important. But what's one factor that you think is just super important but like overlooked by most dentists? So maybe just kind of a different way of answering, you know, kind of that previous question, but important, but kind of overlooked. And again, something that you feel like, hey, if we had a greater focus on this as a profession, we'd all be doing it.
Mary Pham
I think that's something that's overlooked in our profession. It's just making sure that your team is as passionate as you are with what it is that you're doing. And I think that's something that is difficult as you continue to grow your organization. Your reach isn't as close as one office with five team members. Now you have 200 team members and one of you. So how do you make sure that you're not doing everything and that your vision and your message is still being passed over to all the members of your team and with the same level of passion and vision and dedication. So I think that that's something that's really important and that maybe not focused on as much is really making sure that you develop leaders that can help fulfill the company's vision and what it is that you're trying to achieve. And I think that's something that I learned later is I thought that I could do everything on my own. But now that I've grown my company, it's actually really cool to see as I've developed as a leader that a lot of my team has as well.
Matt Allen
100% spoken like a true great leader there. I love that empowering other people is so critical and that idea of team-based care in our practices means so much. So, especially as it relates to experience, right? Because they're gonna touch a lot of people along their journey and we want everyone to have that same kind of vision and that same kind of, you know, yeah, just passion like you're talking about. So, love it. Thank you so much for sharing.
Mary, this is, we could talk all day. I know I'd like really want to, I just want to like come out to Lollipop and like, you know, hang out with you for a day and just see what's happening. But if people want to connect more with you, if they want to see if maybe they want to bring their patient to you or their kid to you, you know, how can they connect with you? How could they learn more about Lollipop? Just kind of give us, hey, like if I want more of this conversation, where should I go?
Mary Pham
Sure, you can visit us on our website at www.lollipopdental.com. You can always shoot me an email at drmary at lollipopdental.com.
Matt Allen
Perfect, thank you so much. We really appreciate you taking the time out of your busy schedule to join us. It really is just a gift, I think, to so many of our listeners to see what you're doing and to learn from you. That is very generous of you, and we are just grateful that you've taken the time today. So thanks for joining us on Kinda Different, and we look forward to continuing the conversation with you in the future.
Mary Pham
Thank you. Thanks for having me.
